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149. Rope Climbs

149. Rope Climbs

On today’s episode, Ackerman and Fern break down the rope climb. They discuss how to coach the different methods, cue’s and progressions. Along with they talk about it is it worth doing it at your box, how to avoid juries, best practice around them. And do rope climbs have a crossover in real life? They cover this and much more.  Let us know if you like these podcasts on the movements. 

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Timestamps:

(4:58) The practicality of the rope climb at the box level
(6:21) Blackbox Theory
(8:14) The S or J method
(10:20) Min requirement
(13:39) How to coach the rope climb, progression, and building on it
(17:25) Knees to elbows
(18:53) Having a skill at any capacity – Tommy V
(21:09) Rope climbs has made the most progress? 
(26:14) Rope Climb faults
(28:43) Ropes are gross
(30:32) Think so look at as a coach.

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Jason Ackerman:
All right, best hour of their day, we are getting a movement today. You know, we've done this in the past. We've looked at things like Mad Men, but clean the humor deadlift Highpull. And today we're going to focus on a really niche movement. The road climb.

Fern:
Is it niche or niche?

I go back and forth. Because you're not sure how to pronounce the word. So you go with both methods because you don't know which one is right. And then you just sound dumb. Fifty percent of the time.

Fern:
Yeah, like scenario and scenario.

Jason Ackerman:
No. That is scenario.

Fern:
It's yeah, it's only a scenario if you're an asshole.

Jason Ackerman:
It's that scenario if you listen to a tribe called Quest. But, you know, you and I were chatting briefly before this and. And something that comes to my mind this day and age in Crossfit, is do all of these movements that we've looked at in the past need to still be done at the box level? You know, we've touched upon it with things like the snatch. I don't think you removed those. I'm not talking because they're complex. I'm just talking because is the risk worth the reward?

Fern:
I mean, I guess we could just look at data. Right. So if we were to just reference the the the very recent episode with your de facto, like we we know the injury rates are incredibly low and we now know that. Higher frequency of attendance and exposure reduces risk of injury. So I don't know that we could box into any movement that we do and say like, hey, where there is just no real need to do this anymore because the potential for injury is exists there also because there are certain movements that. Have probably more direct.

Fern:
Translation to the real world than others like the snatches, very little direct translation, we all know that it's not functional in the sense that the squad is functional. It's complex and develops more skills, but something like the rope climb. Well, that is something that we are going to encounter. If you're spending any time outdoors and you're getting into rock climbing, climbing trees, like if you have kids, you know, we just installed a bunch of, you know, like hammocks and rings and other stuff in our upstairs room for our daughter. You know, she's climbing. I walk in there this morning at 7 a.m. She's hanging upside down in her legs with her legs in the rings, you know, so like these things actually do carry over to to real life, like the rope climb.

Jason Ackerman:
You know, when I say that, I mean more so in the sense that. The injuries you could get from a road climb are not the same as the types of injuries you would get from a functional movement. Yeah, you can tweak a knee and a squat. You know, you can, you know, bulging disc deadlifting. But the rub, can we see things like shins being destroyed coming down or. I've seen numerous I know if you've ever seen broken ankles because people come down on the rope. You know, obviously a lot of those are avoidable. But we see that the you know, the other thing that comes to mind would be box jumps. You know, do we get rid of box jumps because people are getting their shins eaten a lot eatten lot?

Fern:
No. So this is the this is the whole like, are we gonna throw the baby out with the bathwater discussion? It's like, OK, because because somebody smashed their shin on a box and got stitches. Being a human being and jumping is no longer appropriate. That's just a ridiculous statement, you know. And OK. So people will tear their legs up on the rope. Well, one hundred percent preventable. So it's the same thing with like people coming down off the road and spreading their ankles. One hurden percent preventable. I mean, there's two very simple solutions. If your body is not covered where the rope rubs, you're not getting on the rope. If you're ropes are too long, cut them. Both of those problems very easily solved. So, yeah, I don't think it's I don't think it's like we shouldn't run. The risk of people falling off does exist. But I can't think of a scenario where somebody fell off a rope and we climb and have consistently climbed a rope and our affiliate for 10 years and has literally never happened.

Jason Ackerman:
He had the falling off of the road that I've never seen that, but I've seen numerous people break their ankle or, you know, bone in their foot. And I do believe, like you said, if you have ropes, you need to kind of they should not be on the floor. And they know that was a great rule that you threw up if you'e. You're if you're climbing ropes, the exposed part of your body that is coming down needs to get covered. And usually the shins, they sell all sorts of sleeves that you can throw on there. So assume we're keeping the rope climb. What practicality does it have at the box level?

Fern:
Well, I mean, if it's practical in the sense that, like, it's one of the few things that people are going to encounter in my mind, like. When they leave when they leave the walls of the gym, you know, if they're doing anything outside that involves activity, you know, like you're gonna have to at some point, like pull yourself up off of the ground, whether it be another human being or if you're out with your kids. If your skiing behind a boat or something like that, you're holding on to the handles to do some water skiing. If your climbing outside in the wilderness or what a rock climbing like the rock climb is, is not. Unnatural in my mind. It's a fairly natural human thing to climb things. I mean, we we are basically like smart apes, like climbing as part of our DNA.

Jason Ackerman:
And I think it's one of those movements similar to first pull up, first muscle up, first rope climb. People get really excited about it. And for a lot of people, myself included, I couldn't climb rope until Crossfit,. I mean, high school, I could never get up that rope in the wrestling room. You know, and in Crossfit,, you're able to dive a little bit into the techniques associated with it. But I think a lot of people that's what Crossfit, is all about, giving people those winds that they can take out into the real world. There's few wins out there, but you get him at the box.

Fern:
Yeah. And then some of it is the blackbox theory, which is like, OK, so maybe they don't ever climb rope when they leave the walls of the gym. But their ability to climb rope tells me a lot about other things that they can be that they're gonna be able to do. And that's really the point. And that's the point of Crossfit, in general. So I know you're not going to a snatch, but it does give me a glimpse into what your capacity is, what your mobility is and what your ability is going to be able to succeed in any number of different scenarios in the real world.

Jason Ackerman:
So let let's talk about a you. You're a military guy. Did you have a lot of rope climbs in the military?

Fern:
Not a lot of ropes, so you will do some rope work a little bit. I did a little bit of stuff in some Hilo training. So like coming out of helicopters, but you're generally not climbing a rope into a helicopter or just climb. You're fast roping down a helicopter. Where I did quite a bit of climbing was in the first couple years in the Navy. I had a couple teams and this is pretty common. If you're on a ship, as they have what are called the OBSS teams and their visit, board, search and seizure. So it's kind of like maritime police where you'll go and you'll board other ships and basically search them for drugs, weapons, human trafficking, stuff like that. And you got to climb kading ladders on a on a fairly regular basis, which is like one of these kind of like little tiny wire ladders that kind of like you roll it up and drop it down, you kind of seeing them like any old Batman movies and stuff like that. Yeah, those can be pretty difficult to climb. There is technique that makes it a bit easier, but that's primarily a lot of the climbing that I did in the military is like a lot of ladders. A lot of ladders getting in and out of it from small boats to larger boats. So.

Jason Ackerman:
When we talk about the challenge of climbing, most people teach one of two techniques, right? We talk about the the S or the J. Which do you prefer?

Fern:
I think. So it depends on the athlete. So the S is safer because I have more contact and have more control of the rope. The problem is it's not incredibly efficient because it does require somebody to have better control with their feet of the rope. It's also going back to where we started with this. More contact points on the body. So it's going to be front of the schenn, back of the shin outside of the leg because it's a full wrap around your leg. The other problem that presents is if somebody does kind of get a little loose in a rope like that can create. I have seen injuries in the military primarily where people got their leg caught in there. And basically, like if you fall at a very precise weird angle, like you can break your leg in the rope like it can happen, but. The we teach the J because it's faster. And that is just faster. That's why we teach it.

Jason Ackerman:
Well, what's it look like? I think that's one of the more challenging movements to incorporate into a class. You know, it's not hey, everybody get a barbell because there's not enough ropes for everybody to use. You can have a 16, 20 person class and maybe four ropes. I mean, how many ropes? You have a Crossfit,. Right.

Fern:
We have we have six now. At one point we had nine. Try to get back to nine. And then even if I do get nine, we'll make an adjustment. And I would like to have nine high ropes with a minimum of three low ropes. So we're talking about logistics in the class. One thing, if somebody does not possess the the upper body strength to get on a rope, they should not be climbing for any height. We should probably gonna be doing something that resembles that scaled version of of laying on the floor, pulling yourself to a standing position and then doing that repeatedly to just develop some upper body pulling strings.

Jason Ackerman:
So do you have them on that point? Do you have a minimum requirement? Do you have. Whether it's express to your class or just something in your head, is it. Hey, five-string, go upstairs. Is there something you think of?

Fern:
Well, it's it's kind of that that limiters built in like if you don't have Pull-Ups, you probably don't can't climb rope because I do have to pull my body weight up there. Now we know that it's not a pull up. You're not doing a legless rocklin. There's much more to do with your proficiency, with your feet. But typically, we just don't see it if somebody doesn't have Pull-Ups. They typically don't have rope climbs either. Those kind of go together.

Jason Ackerman:
And when you make that mandatory or is it just to understand that if make it yet self-regulating or.

Fern:
They wont make it mandatory because there are probably those one offs who have figured out their feet and can climb rope, so why hold them back? That's not fair. It's kind of like the whole, you know, people have this same conversation about Kipping Pull-Ups versus strict Pull-Ups. Now we know that we want to have the strength of the shoulder to do a strict pull up. But to some degree, if somebody can do a kipping pull up, I just want them to keep working on the strip. I'm not going to say no, you can't do that during a workout like that would be. Man, that would be really devastating for somebody who can do something, it is like, no, I don't want you to do it. For no particular reason,.

Jason Ackerman:
You mentioned you had nine ropes and now six, is it just because ropes so one of those pieces of equipment that ultimately deteriorated?

Fern:
No. So we had to we had to change some of the anchor points because they were hanging from the landlord, basically didn't want us hanging from certain Raptor's or rafters. So we had to move them. And then so now they don't hang from rafters at all. We had some of the uprights built off of the pull up rig that come out in over our ropes to the top of the rope is probably 14 feet and the ceiling is about fifteen feet. So they would have to climb essentially past the rope to get to the ceiling and people who are proficient can do it. But where I was going with this is dependent. You everybody can spend a little bit of change like they have like I think the 8 foot ropes that you don't even need a shackle for a shackle them to anything depending on where your rig is and how it's set up. You can just they all rogue cells, the ones that come with the ice splice in it, which is that loop at the end of the rope that you would put a shock on. You can just throw that over the rig, run the rope through that that ice splice. And now that is a scaled station for the rope climb. You can have two or three of those in your gym. And what happens now is it cleans it up because now I don't have people who are doing scaled rope, climbs on the high ropes and creating this big log jam for that movement. So and I want to say those are fairly cost effective. So it gives you a lot of options. And when you're done with them, you just kind of push them over to the side, you know, up towards the upright. And then they're really out of the way there. They're not going to get the way of anything.

Jason Ackerman:
Yeah, those are great for scaling options for a class. But also, if you're listening and you have a garage, you may not have high enough ceilings. You can kind of mimic the pull of a rope climb there. And like Fred said, it is a lot of legs, but you still get that grip strength going.

Fern:
And I've seen people that have rope climbs but don't necessarily have a high attachment point. Just do seated rope climbs. Because, you know, you're going to get two to three to four poles, depending on how high that if it's nine feet. And you start from a seated position. I mean, you're gonna get some work in there.

Jason Ackerman:
So but going back to the class. I think Roe climbers are often those things that don't get coached. And it's just like people are expected to develop it. You get that. Ultimately, you get some strength and you've learned had a rope climb. Do you ever set aside time in a class that has rope climbs? And also how often a programming rope lines to which you work on them?

Fern:
Pay at least two times a month. We program McCallum's. I mean, I like rope climbs and I think it's a good skill to develop. And, you know, there is a specific amount of coordination, accuracy, agility for time, 10 general skills, physical skills required to climb a rope. So I think it's a I think it's a necessary skill to develop. So we provide programming at least once or twice a month excuse me, at least two to three times a month. And when we have rope climb as well, we teach everything in a progression. So our progression typically doesn't always look like this, but it looks like, you know, everybody starts from that scaled version just to get the shoulders warmed up. So they lay on the floor, they pull themselves up. We just cycle through, we partner up. And then from there, there's a couple different ways you can start to teach the the technical aspect of getting the feet sorted out. And one of the ways that I think is really beneficial, maybe not in a class, but you can't do it in the classes, have the person set up a box next to the next of the rope. And what they're going to do is now we can have them hold onto the rope from a seated position and and let them sort out their feet while not having to worry about holding themselves on the rope.

Jason Ackerman:
Yes, I've seen and I've seen that work really well.

Fern:
Yeah. So because largely why people get stuck is because they're they're focusing so intently on holding themselves on a rope with their hands that they can't direct their attention to the feet to figure out what needs to happen. They're so removed the strength requirement of holding yourself on the rope and just work on just the aspect of just practice getting your feet sorted out. So we'll play around with that for different people. And then we start with with just one kind of pull. Right. So regardless of who can climb the rope. Everybody gets on the rope. They get their feet sorted out and they basically stand up once and then they come down because all I'm worried about is get their feet sorted out. Can they establish a foothold that allows them to support their own body weight on the rope? Like that's the first thing I need to see. If they can't do that, we can't, Pasko. So we get to practice that and we'll do that two or three times. We'll cycle through. Then I'll start looking at. Are they doing the the legitimate inchworm where they pull their feet up one inch, they move their hands one inch. And now we're talking about eighty seven poles to get to the top of a fifteen foot rope climb.

Fern:
Or they or are we starting to connect the dots between a movement like needs to elbow and how that transfers to a rope climb so that they can get to the top in one, two or three poles when it was previously taking them six poles to get to the top? And this is the old like, hey, why pay $10 for something that costs five? Well Because they don't know how the movement should be performed. You know, that's why guys like Rich Froning, Matt Frazier are so efficient because it's one pull to the top, not because they're six foot eight, but because they jump. They leave their arms long. They pull their feet all the way to their chest. They stand up for so for somebody who's six feet tall and with their hands over the head. That's, you know, eight feet. They jump at 9 feet. They pull their feet up. And no, I'm at 15 feet in one pull because I've just reduced the number of times I need to do execute that skill. So we start ingraining that in there and starting to get skill transfer from things like toes to bar. One thing I've had people do is like get on the road, climb, do three needs to elbows from the rope.

Jason Ackerman:
Yeah, I was going to say, I mean with everything you're saying there. That's why for a lot of scaling options we've incorporated Knee elbows in that road, climbing whether you do. You know, I've seen different things as far as the grip. Some people do. Maybe a 10 second hang and then some knee elbows or a couple of strict pull ups or, you know, a great one that Fern touched upon. And maybe just to make sure it was clear is people actually lying on the ground, grabbing the rope and pulling themself up to standing is a great scaling option.

Jason Ackerman:
But yeah, you see, I mean, everybody remembers maybe not everybody would leave their own Crossfit, a longtime, but. Well, in 2010, road clams cost Rich Froning the games.

Fern:
Yeah, because he was just using his arms and his arms blew up.

Jason Ackerman:
And I think he actually broke his ankle.

Fern:
He did get injured. I remember it was ankle. I actually think it might have been a back or pelvis injury.

Jason Ackerman:
I think he just fell.

Fern:
He did fall it was. Yeah, it was a pretty awful fall, by the way.

Jason Ackerman:
But then, you know, he came back the next year in the very first work out of the Crossfit, games was, I believe, clean and jerks and rope climbs subtitled Riches Revenge. And he won that event. So clearly something. It's a skill you need to work on. And all the things that ferne just touched upon are important. Now. Are there ways in which you make it more challenging for your members? Obviously we watch the games or, you know, sanctions and we're seeing legless rope climb to these higher ropes. What are some of the things you do at the box level?

Fern:
Well, before I make it difficult, I think it'd be. Better to talk about those people who were in the middle rights of people who like are starting to develop the rope climb. But like, maybe, you know, for instance, fifteen feet is not an option. So we treat the rope climb pretty much how we treat everything else, which is if you've got the skill in any capacity. That's what we're doing. So when I would give the ward brief, I would brief it this way, guys, if we can climb the rope. That's what we're gonna do. You're gonna go as high as you can come down safely. So if that's one pole and you come down cool, it's still a rock on. It's just an eight foot rock climbing is that of a fifteen foot rope climb, but it's still a rope climb. So so first thing will adjust is the height to try to get that. And the second thing will adjust as the volume. So something like. We just did a variation of Tommy V recently, which is twenty seven rope climbs.

Jason Ackerman:
I'm a classic hero work that you don't really see that often. I remember running that at Albany Crossfit,. There's a video out there on YouTube somewhere. But yeah, the members were just loving. We had like two ropes and there was just a line of people waiting to rope. But yeah, great workout

Fern:
And and that's where my favorite workouts of all time. You know, like I think like the day I did that work out in like under 10 minutes, I like threw a party for myself. It was like the greatest thing ever. But.

Jason Ackerman:
It's thrusters and rope clans, right?

Fern:
Yeah. So it's twenty one fifty and thrusters at at 1:15 and then twelve nine six ropeclimbs.

Jason Ackerman:
Right.

Fern:
And yeah. I'm, I'm a fan of both movements. Right. So it's that would be something that would fall on my wheelhouse thrusters and rope climbs. But so we put it in there and then so for some people who can climb rope I'm like twenty seven. That's a lot of rope lines like I don't give a shit who you are, like that is a lot of rope climb. So what we'll do is we'll adjust the volume for those people, like just typical scaling. Hey. Twenty seven is not good for you, but let's try to get something that looks like fifteen. Right. So again, like if we have the skill, don't scale down to a two an easier movement, skill to volume, scale to height until they can start to get more proficient. And when you exercise both of those two scaling options, people tend to get things like that much faster.

Jason Ackerman:
Is there a movement in Crossfit, that you think has gained as much efficiency over the years as the rail line?

Jason Ackerman:
Meaning it's one of those movements that. From two thousand say let's go to two thousand six to two thousand twenty now. What movement has made the most progress? I'd have to say rock climbing is up there. I mean, two thousand, six and seven. Even the best we're doing hand-over-hand, you know, lifting your knees a little bit. We're like you said, now Frazier's in Brownings are doing one pole. Are there any other movements that have that type of growth? I mean, you build up things like the snatch and the like. You've mentioned things like this snatch in the past like.

Fern:
The snatch ,the snatch is definitely one. I mean, the fact that we could swing a dead cat and try to find somebody around here that's not just two. Seventy five is is comical. But the robe climbs definitely up there. I mean, when they did that in regionals, whatever it was two years ago and guys were doing Tommy V eight minutes. And just so that we can have a little context here. That's eight minutes and they were having to travel back. This is not eight minutes where my barbells next to my rope.

Jason Ackerman:
They were running up and down a field running.

Fern:
They were running down the field of play, which is just mind blowing. And this is where guys like, you know, Elijah Muhammad are doing. Like he's not even doing a full like one pull. He's doing like a half a pull because. Yeah. Like a thirty six inch vertical and just tap the top. But yeah, I mean people are incredibly efficient at that movement and not just the males because that's how it was in the beginning. But now the females are crushing. Regular road climbs, legless road climbs. You know, that was I mean, if you think about the Crossfit, games this past year, like the rope climb, oddly enough, was like the separator in that first. Then in the first event, like there were literally people who literally never got to see the barbell.

Jason Ackerman:
I think I've told the story on the podcast. Bad Judge, that is from India. I think he got one, maybe two. And then I just sat there watching him fail for the next 17 minutes.

Fern:
Yeah. And we're talking about doing what was it two Legless rope climbs ?

Jason Ackerman:
I think it was three I think they ran four hundred three and then the snatches.

Fern:
And then the snatches, which were they?

Jason Ackerman:
You're right. It might have been too. I don't remember.

Fern:
It was either two or three. We could agree that it wasn't a time to try to get through round one.

Jason Ackerman:
Correct.

Fern:
And so people yeah, I would say that Owen has made tremendous strides, but still, clearly people got a ways to go there.

Jason Ackerman:
Well, I think also unique to the rope climb at the competition level, as you've seen this evolution of, you know, intensity or skill, however you want to define it. But it went from, hey, your ropes, climb them. And then it became like your ropes. You know, you have to control yourself up and down. And then it went to legless. And now there's. Before legless, there was the short ropes, which meant you had to do like a couple legless poles into a regular rope climb. And now it's just like a straight up. It's just cool to see the. Fitness evolution in the world.

Fern:
Well, it's also I mean, people most of it all knows, but like rock climbing, rope is a has been a staple of gymnastics for years. Like you're not going to walk into a gymnastics facility that doesn't have a rope where they practice pulling from seated and L positions just to establish midline stabilization, you know, core strength. So, yeah, I mean, I think it's an incredibly valuable skill. But again, like most things and what we want try to get people to do is like people suck at rock climbing because they don't do them frequently enough. And then B, nobody's teaching them how to do it. And there's some really old I mean, like old videos. If somebody can find these in the journal archives of Adrienn at Crossfit,, San Francisco, doing Adrian barzman, doing some like rope climbing tutorials. So if somebody can find those like pull them up and then if you can post it, tag us on it. But like there's some old stuff in there that like you go back that's super valuable. He talked about the ask versus the J. But let's talk about that. Let's talk about the feet. So, like, what's your what's your what do you use to ask through the J.

Jason Ackerman:
I use the J. But in full disclosure, I'm not great at road crimes and I just kind of do what comes naturally with my feet accidentally, but it's the J when I first learned it was the S and like you said, it's cumbersome. We had to kind of throw your leg around and try to catch the rope again. Now I use the J and I've gotten a little bit better at them. I can do them in a workout. I know blow up. But there's still something that they're they're challenging. And like you said, I think part of it is most people, myself included, using touch rope climbs, you know, once or twice a month when they come up. And I'd say more boxes than not, don't program them, might not even have ropes.

Fern:
Yeah. So if you're gonna teach at one of the big things. From what? From a coaching aspect, what should I be looking at? Well, the big thing is the feet in one of the biggest errors. If you're watching the video version of this, you'll be able to see this. But imagine, just put one foot on the floor and then literally put your other foot on top of that foot. So take the sole of your right foot and just place it on the shoelaces of your left foot. That's a fault. Right. If I'm if I'm doing rope climbs, having one foot on top of the other is a fault. The reason for that is there's physics involved here. And this is what we would describe as like if you think what would happen if the rope went between my feet? It would do about a 45 degree angle change. Right. So as it comes under one foot, that's standing on top of the other one, it does about forty five degrees before it kind of drops off the other side. Keto. If I'm doing a video like my feet would be here and the rope would come in and then come out the other side. Like if you've spent any time on boats, you've heard the term bite, right? So the bite is I want the rope to be taught and I want there to be as much friction on the rope as possible. So I want there to be a bite on that rope and then to have the best bite in that position for a J. It's called a J. Because that's the shape. The rope is gonna do a full hundred and eighty degree change of direction. And I can only do that if my feet are side by side, not stacked on top of each other.

Jason Ackerman:
Right. Actually, it changes direction and starts to come back up under the other foot. Yeah.

Fern:
Yeah. So it goes under one foot and then over the other foot because my feet are next to each other. And that 180 degree turn or that bite that I now have on the rope is what allows me to have a secure foot placing on the rope. If my feet are on top of each other, these are the people that put their feet and they lock in. And then they push down with their feet and then their feet just slide down the rope. And it's because they don't have the bite on the rope that they need. So that's the first thing I would look at is just like you can people get their feet sorted out and these are the folks that you want to have them practice from a seated position. Just making sure that they're getting their feet next to each other, not on top of each other. And they're squeezing their feet together on the way up. My feet should be like really, really tight the whole time. And then when I come down, I just take them apart. And now I can control the speed of the descent just based on how far apart my feet are.

Jason Ackerman:
Further apart. The more you'll slow down.

Fern:
Yeah, kind of depends. But like as soon as I separate, I'm gonna lose that bite. So now I'm gonna start to be able to like slide down the rope a little bit.

Jason Ackerman:
And that's where you see people throwing on the shin guards or pulling their socks up or wearing pants to protect that rubbing on the shin. I mean, if you're listening to this and you're excited, you're thinking about adding some deep programming or doing some yourself. Careful of that. I've seen some nasty rope burns that can lead to things like staph infection and MRSA. And we're so, so really be aware of that something. Rope's charges things.

Fern:
Yeah. You're not going to clean them for the most part. It's gross. Like you don't want people's DNA getting on other people. And so on that note, just spend the extra money to go buy like a like a dozen pair of like soccer socks or high knee socks and just keep them at the gym or like some real, real cheap. Like the not the shin guards but like the shin compression sleeves so that, you know, if somebody can climb rope, you know, our rules like if it's not covered, you don't get on the rope. So we'll just we've got extra stuff sitting around the gym that people can use or wear pants or socks or a lot of people throw any sleeve on like I wear. It knee sleve now. I just throw it on. I know exactly where it rubs. That is basically what that knee sleve it at the bottom of my ankle and it takes care of it. So but if it's not covered, they don't get on the rope because they're going to get burned. It's now it's gross. I've got I've got all sorts of weird potential stuff that could happen. And having that extra friction on the leg is gonna help.

Fern:
Climbing, right, like the more friction I have there, the better off I'm going to be. So it's it's actually going to help you climb ropes a little bit.

Jason Ackerman:
So, you know, you mentioned the other foot being stacked. Is there anything else as a coach that you look for while your athletes are doing rope climbs other than safety precautions, you know, keeping your hands on coming down under control? You know, running down low enough that you're not going to fall to your death. But are there any other things that you look for?

Fern:
Yeah. So there's there's two big ones that I think are really inhibit people from climbing the rope. So the first one is just getting their feet sorted out. So if they can't get their feet sort out, everything is hard enough to rely on my arms even more. And generally, these come together and it will make sense here in just a second. But if I don't get my feet sorted out, then my arms have to do more work. And there's limitations on that. And once my arms blow up, I'm not climb anymore rope. We've all seen that competition where, like, they just can't pull anymore. The other one has to do with the arms and you see people who are climbing the rope and they and they're consistently in that 90 degree bend of the elbow. Right. So they never actually extend their arm and reach up the rope. So it would be the equivalent of doing pull ups and never getting the elbow to full extension. So every time you came down, you stopped a little bit short. It's so much more difficult that way, like basically the way we all used to do Pull-Ups.

Jason Ackerman:
Yeah. And you trash your bicep tendon.

Fern:
Right. So that's the other thing is getting people to really reach up the rope and instead of hanging and getting their feet sawed off from this bent over position, have them hang from a straight arm position, because now they're going to be able to stay on the rope longer because their biceps are not doing the work. Now it's just my grip. So that's where we're doing drills like the hanging needs to elbow from. The rope will teach good arm position on the ropes so that my arms are extended and long, giving my biceps a break versus holding myself in this position. So when we go through the progression and we do that one to pull, we'll have them jump them on the rope, hang with long arms, pull their feet up, get their feet locked in stand. And then the last step is reach again just to set the next pole. So they get in the habit of like that, because what they'll do if they don't do it, they'll stand. They'll move their hands.

Fern:
One hand grip up.

Fern:
And not cover any distance on the rope. You know, if you reach your arms up the rope, you're going to cover an additional two feet and then repeat that process. So first one is the feet. The second one is make sure people are reaching up the rope, getting long arms. Because I'm trying to reduce the number of poles they need to get to the top.

Jason Ackerman:
Well, like you mentioned earlier, real world application. Now they live out in Boulder, Colorado. I have to do Boulder, Colorado things. And one of those is rock climbing. And it's the same principle like you don't want to constantly be in that flexed elbow position. You want to stand. And really, that's that rope climbing and rock climbing. It's all about just continuing to do knee tucks or need elbows and standing up again. Yeah. If you do it well, your grip, that's going to get tired, of course, but it's not going to be the limiting factor.

Fern:
It will take significantly longer for that to happen. Like the like the the volume now is the. Is that is the issue.

Jason Ackerman:
It becomes your your metabolic system.

Fern:
Yeah. So those are the two big ones. Those are the two like real, real big issues that I see. You have the romcoms. I can't get their feet sorted out and they haven't figured out that. You think I like to teach you? Think of it as in it, as an inchworm. You know, the interim like scrunches up and then it lengthens out. Like, that's what I want to be doing on the road. I don't want to do like fifteen little short extensions. I want to do a full extension and then get to the top and one to two goals.

Jason Ackerman:
Absolutely. And I think it would be cool is if you listen to this episode and you've decided to test out some of these theories yourself or incorporate it into your own programming, which, by the way, rope climbs will be in the best hour programming. And there will be progressions and there will be things to be looking for which is coming out really any day now. Right.

Fern:
Yep. Yeah. We're just waiting on a couple of things. But it's it's ready to go. We're just waiting on a couple of the platforms to get sorted out.

Jason Ackerman:
And those of you that have emailed us about it, you know, we've gotten back to you. But if you're still interested in learning more best hour of their day at Gmail dot com or of course on our Instagram, you can DMI. But we've got a lot of great stuff coming up. We're going to I think we're we've already changed the landscape of the Crossfit, podcast. Now we're going to do the same with programming.

Fern:
Well, listen, I'm just glad that you're back to saying outlandish shit and 20/20 to pick up where we left off.

Jason Ackerman:
By the way, as we wrap up this episode.

Fern:
Can we talk about last night?

Jason Ackerman:
Yes. I have no idea.

Jason Ackerman:
But anyway, we are we we are getting these clips from the road trip. And now our video guide me is putting this together. Together the episodes, but then also sending us small clips for social media. So you see these small clips. You know, our video guy, Nate is putting them together. And then we went to a box. We went to hammer different Crossfit,, which was one of my I mean, they were all great. But, you know, we had a unique experience. There were Steph Hammer took us through a workout as adaptive athletes. Fern, you went through it kind of like with one arm.

Fern:
Yeah, I was basically being dowdy, essentially like, no. Logan, sorry. Yeah.

Jason Ackerman:
Logan Minus the fact that he cleans more than you with one arm. Way more. And I was in a wheelchair and it was a fuckin challenge. Yeah. Then at some point, first of all, I was I don't like to watch movies, a video, but I was Roz was like, what are you doing? You're laughing and crying at the same time. I was laughing so hard.

Fern:
So I was honestly a little worried about that episode because you. Worst so disruptive. I was I was truly worried. I was I was thinking to myself, this is going to be horrific.

Jason Ackerman:
Well, the one clip where you're like, I'm stuck with this idiot. That was my favorite clip. But the other clip is at some point I challenge Steph Haberman to a race. And I'm racing her like, you know, in wheelchairs. And she's beating me and I. I thought my arms were blowing up because I'm not familiar with being in a wheelchair. And then I watched the video and Fern as somehow not only latched on, but you positioned yourself in a way that I couldn't see you. And I was like. We are basically going against resistance. So it's a step by step if you're listening, that's not it.

Fern:
Not even close. I was I was never gonna let it happen. So if you're struggling, if you're struggling to kind of a division, so j challenges stuff to a race and I'm just not going to let him win. So he kind of passes me and then I kind of scoot behind him and then I just hold onto the back of the chair like a break. But he has no idea I'm back there. We filmed this in November and made an I did not tell him this because I was it.

Jason Ackerman:
You like talk about it behind my back.

Fern:
One hundred percent. Yeah. We I I committed I was like, I am not going to tell you this. I want you to see this on your own and then realize what happened. And the funny part is hearing you talk like this is really hard. I think my chair stuck. That's why I was laughing so hard, because you literally no idea was behind you.

Well, you know, a, I'm not familiar with being in a chair. And B, as Steph was teaching us, there's like all sorts of chairs and different things. I'm like, well, maybe this just isn't like a fast chair.

Jason Ackerman:
Yeah. It's going to be a great episode because it is, like you said, a, very disruptive. But B, we learned at a time like it's as goofy as we were. It was eye opening to what some of these adaptive athletes. Go through, but also can do.

Fern:
Yeah. And the just so everybody I don't have we announce a date. So the first episode is gonna drop January 14th a week.

Jason Ackerman:
Well, we're we're recording this on the 7th till a week from today.

Fern:
Yeah. We from today the first episode will drop and I'm I'm stoked because these episodes are gonna be in between like 15 to 20 minutes long of and they're gonna be jam packed with content like different things about Jim logistics and how you setup your gym and coaching and programming and just all sorts of stuff. So I think I think people are going to enjoy it and and not only be entertained, but but I think there's a decent amount of education in there, too. So I'm really stoked about it. We've only seen five of the episodes I think. Yeah.

Jason Ackerman:
So so far. Yeah. There's what's really cool too is you would think that we go to ten boxes and there's a lot of repeat knowledge, but really every box is so different that. Did we gain something new and really different lessons for the present listeners to check out or for the viewers to check out and that every box is so unique that there's different things that we can talk about?

Fern:
Yeah. What's cool is I was a little worried that there was gonna be a. It was going to be the same, but there is there is almost there's little to no redundancy from episode episode about what we discussed and what we see and what we and what we do there. So, yeah, I think I think it's gonna be really, really cool. So check it out. January 14th at that'll launch on YouTube. We got feedback course send it our way. Affiliated programming probably be launching around that same time.

Jason Ackerman:
And then. If you're listen to this, the best out of their day book just came out today. Well, today is the seventh. So check that out.

Fern:
I had no part in that. So it'll be probably just OK.

Jason Ackerman:
That's one of my favorite. I don't know if you remember this way. This is way back when we were working the summer together.

Jason Ackerman:
Remember, like usually we'll give a lecture and then I'd be like, how did it go? Type of thing to do. Our colleagues, the other people. And you were like, adequate. It's like so that I use that line all the time. I think that was adequate. It's such a it's such a word that's like it just kicks you in the balls. It was you covered the material, so. All right. Well, hopefully you don't want to miss those episodes. Go to our YouTube channel right now and subscribe best hour of their day. We put up every podcast, like Fern said earlier, and we'll be putting up these clips, really be putting up the full episodes. So you want to check that out?

Fern:
Yeah. And then if you haven't registered for WOD in the waves, I'm almost positive that's gonna sell out. So use could best hour. We'll be doing some stuff. There are running classes, doing some mentor stuff there too. So it's gonna be really, really cool.

Jason Ackerman:
Yeah, I'm excited for it. I mean we posted earlier on our Instagram how they were named and one of the top vacations by Forbes magazine. That's a pretty big deal. Best hour . And you'll be entered to attend some private stuff from Fern tonight.

Fern:
Yep.

Jason Ackerman:
So really cool. We'll see you guys there. But thanks for listening. Hopefully that helped and gave me some insight into the rock climbs and we're excited for a big twenty twenty four best hour of their day.

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